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jkingsman 22 hours ago [-]
AO3 rocks, as does the parent organization, the Organization for Transformative Works. They do a lot of pro bono legal work around free speech and copyright (which can be especially sticky around transformative works). AO3 has drawn ire and appreciation alike for their fierce free speech stance (which is, essentially, if it's against the law to exhibit in the state of New York (or against their TOS e.g. not a fanwork), it must come down. Everything -- EVERYTHING -- else stays.)
I also love another of their programs, Fanlore[0], a treasure trove of obscure internet fanfiction works, social groupings, and tropes. Sort of a combination oral history + TVTropes-esque fanfic breakdown.
Fanfiction is a beautiful thing and a great way to stretch creative writing muscles that can be helpful by being a bit less of a blank canvas than needing to invent characters and locations. Of course, a TON of fanfiction does invent, liberally, but I've seen people insist they can't write creatively, then make something beautiful when you ask them to rewrite a scene in their favorite show or book that they were disappointed with and boom, they just wrote their first fix-it fic[1].
Also, praise be for AO3 having no news feed/algorithm, and instead an incredibly intricate tagging system. Makes it easy to find what you want, avoid what you don't (see free speech commitment), and feel liberated from algorithmic exhaustion.
There is. Presumably, they mean you can’t upload the full text of someone else’s book and have it remain up.
scythe 21 hours ago [-]
They're pretty open about it in practice. They don't want people hosting blogs, basically. Original fiction is almost always allowed.
scythe 20 hours ago [-]
>I've seen people insist they can't write creatively, then make something beautiful
Yeah, now you have a worse problem. A few people like the first chapter you posted, now "oh shit I'd better come up with something good".
A curse on the OP. I was trying so hard to stop thinking about this today.
causesothere 21 hours ago [-]
AO3 is wonderful. I strongly believe that humans have tens of thousands of years of telling and retelling stories. The Odyssey isn't one book, it's something that was composed and collected and retold.
The idea that a company could "own" a story and the characters within is recent. Very recent.
IMO, AO3 continues the human tradition of retelling stories, and we should celebrate that.
tourmalinetaco 14 hours ago [-]
This is why I’m a copyright minimalist. 15 years + 5 years extension is my belief. I should be legally allowed to use what I grew up on to tell stories and invent within that world and, if the market enjoys it, make some money doing it. Anything more is various shades of immoral, and the current 95-150yr terms are closer to something from parody than reality.
ckx 7 hours ago [-]
There could also be a downside to this, lets use Super Mario as an example, what happens when the entire market gets flooded with unofficial Mario games, scammers would no longer have to worry about copyright and can make absolute shovelware to trick old people hoping to buy a Christmas present for their grandchildren etc. Nintendo as a company would be completely helpless against all of this and sure, there could may well be some great games made by people who care, but the cons would outweigh the pros.
corroclaro 6 hours ago [-]
trademarks? Nintendo is still protected as Nintendo with its logo and all. We'd start seeing Nintendo's Super Mario and be all "ahh, great, the fun one!"
my-huge-pony 3 hours ago [-]
Or even "Bob's Super Mario? Ah, great, the fun one". More fun Mario games for us.
DuperPower 7 hours ago [-]
but that would literally destroy capitalism at a symbolic level. copyright is the one thing holding all the myths
krapp 6 hours ago [-]
We've had myths for hundreds of thousand of years without copyright. If it's a choice between capitalism and culture then we should destroy capitalism at a symbolic level.
arjie 20 hours ago [-]
There's no way to just download all of it, is there? You have to scrape it slowly? I don't mind doing it that way, but flat downloads would be pretty neat. How do mirrors work? Do they run read-through caches?
Makes sense. Somewhat strange (but not too strange since it's not standardized) they don't have a Crawl-Delay except for Slurp. Why not on User-Agent: *
Confusing. Would even prefer a commented crawl delay that specifies in human language since then I could special-case it.
Seattle3503 19 hours ago [-]
I feel like I am coming in to the middle of a discussion. Towards what end?
arjie 19 hours ago [-]
Just data hoarding tendencies, faster and better search, etc.
brokensegue 19 hours ago [-]
there's some dumps on archive.org
i worked on a project a long time ago and downloaded a bunch of it
arjie 19 hours ago [-]
Thank you. Do you still have your archive? I'd email you if you had address on profile.
brokensegue 15 hours ago [-]
I think I uploaded the only archive I had
18 hours ago [-]
dmd 18 hours ago [-]
Weird to see this here. I posted my first story of any length to it just a few days ago, a short story in the universe of Iain M. Banks' Culture.
If you all are interested in fanfic, may I direct you to learn about one of my favorite pieces of internet art, my immortal?
And, if you want to delve into the history behind this work of art, oh boy:
https://youtu.be/0JodBp-r9jM
Blackthorn 17 hours ago [-]
It's nice that this sprung up after the owners of fanfiction.net seemed to completely stop caring about it. It's nice to have a place where the people who run it actually care.
ballmerpoint 21 hours ago [-]
I disapprove of how much underage material they host. Free speech absolutism runs head-first into its internal contradictions.
mjd 19 hours ago [-]
I suppose it won't help to point out to you that it's fiction, none of it actually happened, no person was ever hurt, and this is nowhere close to ”free speech absolutism”.
It’s acceptable on AO3 to write a narrative description of a real person’s actual abuse, including their personal information (see II.F.4.a), and it only “may result in a judgment of harassment” if also the author specifically makes it available to the victim.
The policy is unsafe by design.
TheOtherHobbes 18 hours ago [-]
It's the written equivalent of deepfake porn - hugely entertaining for the creators, not so much for the victims. Especially if they're teens at school, and the creators are bullying them.
No matter what AO3 thinks, in many countries this immediately crosses the line into criminal harassment.
As for the rest - the fanfic community has been among the loudest criticising AI writing for 'stealing from real artists', which is... not exactly self-aware.
fwlr 17 hours ago [-]
What is not self-aware about criticising machines for stealing the work that you were previously doing?
letmevoteplease 19 hours ago [-]
There is no contradiction here. It was founded precisely because LiveJournal started censoring sexually explicit fanfiction involving taboo subjects (particularly incest/rape/minors).
I also love another of their programs, Fanlore[0], a treasure trove of obscure internet fanfiction works, social groupings, and tropes. Sort of a combination oral history + TVTropes-esque fanfic breakdown.
Fanfiction is a beautiful thing and a great way to stretch creative writing muscles that can be helpful by being a bit less of a blank canvas than needing to invent characters and locations. Of course, a TON of fanfiction does invent, liberally, but I've seen people insist they can't write creatively, then make something beautiful when you ask them to rewrite a scene in their favorite show or book that they were disappointed with and boom, they just wrote their first fix-it fic[1].
Also, praise be for AO3 having no news feed/algorithm, and instead an incredibly intricate tagging system. Makes it easy to find what you want, avoid what you don't (see free speech commitment), and feel liberated from algorithmic exhaustion.
[0]: https://fanlore.org/wiki/Main_Page
[1]: https://fanlore.org/wiki/Fix-it
Isn’t there an “original work” category?
Yeah, now you have a worse problem. A few people like the first chapter you posted, now "oh shit I'd better come up with something good".
A curse on the OP. I was trying so hard to stop thinking about this today.
The idea that a company could "own" a story and the characters within is recent. Very recent.
IMO, AO3 continues the human tradition of retelling stories, and we should celebrate that.
Confusing. Would even prefer a commented crawl delay that specifies in human language since then I could special-case it.
i worked on a project a long time ago and downloaded a bunch of it
https://archiveofourown.org/works/94745346
It’s acceptable on AO3 to write a narrative description of a real person’s actual abuse, including their personal information (see II.F.4.a), and it only “may result in a judgment of harassment” if also the author specifically makes it available to the victim.
The policy is unsafe by design.
No matter what AO3 thinks, in many countries this immediately crosses the line into criminal harassment.
As for the rest - the fanfic community has been among the loudest criticising AI writing for 'stealing from real artists', which is... not exactly self-aware.